Announcement Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Spring Roo going forward Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse
X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Spring Roo going forward

    I am a big fan of Spring Roo and it's potential, but am a bit concerned with Roo and where it can go. I recently had a discussion on a Javaranch Forum with one of the authors of the Spring Roo In Action book, Ken Rimple, here's what I wrote him:

    I like Roo as well and I do see potential for it, but there are some aspects of it that makes me think that it's not quite ready for prime time (i.e. can I take a project in Spring Roo beyond creating prototypes). The rigidity on the web tier is a tough sell. I am a server-side developer for the most part, but what drew me to Spring Roo was the possibility of putting up JEE/Spring based applications quickly. Part of the reason I enjoy server side development vs. web development is the web just adds more stuff to configure and deal with. A tool like Spring Roo has the potential to eliminate a lot of the config nightmare that goes along with JEE development. However Roo seems kind of rigid on the web tier. Spring based tools are renowned for their flexibility/adaptability. The Spring Roo project needs to make that web tier more flexible to really have a fighting chance against Grails and Rails.

    I have played around with Roo and I think it's pretty cool, but my concern is building something with Roo and having to integrate it into a current Spring project. There seems to be a fair amount fo code removal you have to do. It's as if all of the work that Roo saved gets wasted because you have to go back and retro fit Roo into what you have already built. It seems to me that if Roo wants to really make an impact they have to make the web tier as flexible as possible. This is where a majority of potential Roo developers will come from, and the web tier needs the most flexibility. Furthermore, developers should need to remove only a minimal amount of code to make Roo generated code fit a current Spring project. Right now Spring Roo seems fine if you are starting from scratch, but if you have a current Spring project, integrating Roo may be more work than a developer may want. And most development is maintenance/upgrading a current system versus start from scratch development.

    Ken suggested I make my comments known on this forum, which I am doing now. Again, I am a Spring Roo advocate and love the possibilities. I think there are somethings to be worked out, but nothing that's a deal killer. I am willing to put my money where my mouth if need be and contribute, time and effort to this project. I just want to see Roo get the kind of exposure and juice that Rails and Grails gets. With some changes, I believe Roo can become the go to tool for building Spring projects quickly and easily.

    Thanks,

    JW

  • #2
    @jwhite1202,


    Please review my development blog; which is 99.99% dedicated to Spring Roo...
    The blog is @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com

    Specially visit the following 100% Spring Roo application at:
    1. http://75.127.101.146/gnc/gnc-debug/gnc.html
    2. http://75.127.101.146/worldAlmanac/

    Tell me anything you want about them. What you like it. What you didn't like it. If you want score them.

    In exchange, I'll tell you what is missing on Spring Roo for being a successful rock star development tool!.


    Thank you in advance
    jD

    Comment


    • #3
      We are colaborating too with Spring Roo from gvNIX project.
      Any suggestion is well come

      Comment


      • #4
        I think, I should have called it Spring Roo: Flexibility in the Web Tier...
        But I ended calling it Spring Roo: Visual Eip and is @http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com/201...isual-eip.html


        B. Roogards
        jD @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com

        Comment


        • #5
          @delgad9, I have seen your work and it is quite interesting. It does give me some ideas as to what I can do with Spring Roo for new development. I am under the impression that Spring Roo would be good (especially if you are fine with the current tool set Roo offers) for brand new development, I am a bit more concerned with what happens when you have an existing Spring Project (web or stand-alone), and you want to integrate something built with Roo into the current project. I am concerned with building something with Roo, getting it working and functional and then having to make significant changes to the Roo code to make it work with the Current Spring Code and losing much if not all of the productivity gains I had by using Roo in the first place. To me that is the real deterrent to using Roo for doing much beyond prototyping and new development.

          Comment


          • #6
            @Mario,

            Your project looks compelling. The tutorials look interesting as well. Is gvnix compatable with version 1.2.x of Spring Roo? I believe I have version 1.2.2 on both my Windows and Linux laptops. Is there anything special I would need to watch out for if I tried to use gvnix with the newer version of Roo? Also, I saw that the install file was for Linux is there a Windows install as well?

            Comment


            • #7
              @jwhite1202,

              Hello JW,

              It is great that my work on SR brought you new ideas on it...
              Basically, its is one of its major purposes. "Provide an approach on connecting SR with real-world development". Beyond books and tutorials that basically reproduce the reference manual but fall short on helping developers on tackling the problems that they are facing in the jobs. I am trying to complement them with my development-point-of-view.

              Your concern about using SR on legacy Spring apps is genuine and understandable. Actually, your point make me salivate on it. I think, I am going to investigate such issue and dedicate some blog articles addressing it.


              Thank you and...
              B. and inspiring Roogards
              jD @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com

              Comment


              • #8
                Please do. I would be interested to see what you come up with.

                Thx,

                JW

                Comment


                • #9
                  @jwhite1202,

                  Please let me know in case you know individuals or organizations that....
                  1. Would like to provide real-word Java web legacy apps for going to the "Rooimzing" process
                  2. Would like to support and/or sponsor such work.

                  I truly believe the outcome is a win-win situation for everybody interested in SR.

                  Roogards
                  jD @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I personally am interested. I would like to use Spring Roo to extend legacy Spring applications. I think if it can be demonstrated that it can be done, then I am sure I could get my boss on board and developers across the country who work for the company I work for. I am no master of Spring Roo, I do understand the basics, but it is something that I am interested in and would like to extend my knowledge on. From a sponsorship perspective (i.e. money I imagine), I would have to talk to my boss and see what could be done financially to get this off and running, but the first step would be getting something in front of him and his superiors that could work and that would save some money. Once that hurdle is cleared, then I think we have something to work with.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      @jwhite1202,

                      Yes...

                      Please talk to Management about it. Show my stuff to them.

                      Remember about my point about: "What is missing for being a successful...".

                      This is exactly what is needed: Open source developers that believe that "things" can be improved. Willing to try new approaches and take "reasonable" risks. Instead of just waiting that the "community" solve their problems 100%.

                      Don't worry about your expertise on SR. You are a Java Web Developer; this is what matters to me. Believe me, if this baby flies: you are going to learn "stuff" and most importantly: the Company that you work for would develop an strategic advantage. "Not bad at all" to have on this global competitive world.


                      B. and "charging-Java-development-weapons" Roogards
                      jD

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I'll do that. I have a meeting with my boss this Friday. I am already sending him an email to prep him for the discussion I want to have with him. I will send him links to your work and let him know that I would like to work on developing a way to making Roo more productive for legacy application integration. I agree that this is a win-win. Send me a private message and I'll send you my contact information, we can stay in contact beyond this forum.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jwhite1202 View Post
                          I'll do that. I have a meeting with my boss this Friday. I am already sending him an email to prep him for the discussion I want to have with him. I will send him links to your work and let him know that I would like to work on developing a way to making Roo more productive for legacy application integration. I agree that this is a win-win. Send me a private message and I'll send you my contact information, we can stay in contact beyond this forum.
                          Hello JW,

                          Any news?

                          Thank you
                          jD @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com/?view=timeslide

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            He likes the idea, but would have to see something tangible before making some sort of investment. I think the best thing that could be done would be to have something tangible and concrete to show. And then be able to demonstrate how it would either save or make money. I can assure you there would be no sponsorship before that happens. So let me know how you want to move forward.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Okay, this is my proposal for moving forward...

                              a) If you guys want to save-money in your sdlc:
                              1. We would have to identify what are the roadblocks that are sucking time/money.
                              2. Find the way on how SR can help eliminating or mitigating the root cause.
                              b)If you guys want to make-money:
                              1. Define a uses cases or apps that you want to implement using SR and contrast them to others options.

                              For both cases, we can develop case studies that would go through all the stages: from stating the problem to delivering strategies, practices and working apps. The case studies mechanism would be the way to deliver the evidence that you are asking.

                              Put it this way... We would like to see if a medicine works on a patient. We applied it to the patient in a small dosage and measure the improvements. And metaphorical speaking would be at the cost of an aspirin.

                              What you guys think?
                              jD @ http://pragmatikroo.blogspot.com

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X