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  • Maintenance Policy change?

    Hi

    I have a question about the new maintenance policy.

    What are the plans for the time frame of major releases? I think it's no problem when major releases come out every 4-5 month. Is this the plan?

    Kind regards
    Björn

  • #2
    I think that the whole spring community is interested in the exact plans of Spring Source.

    A few things are unclear to me:
    - is it possible to create a stable release based on the public repository. The maintenance releases are provided to paying customers, and the bug fixes are published to the public repository, but are the tags of the maintenance releases also visible in the public repository?
    - what happens when there is a large period between the last 'public' maintenance release, and the first new major release. Upgrading to a non existing major release is not an option, and working with a problem-causing bug also is not an option. So could it be that we are stuck with public versions that contain bugs, even though they are fixed in payed versions?

    Upgrading to a major new version in a production environment is not done anyway. So saying that developers want to use the newest stuff is just ignoring reality.

    I think it is very important for Spring Source to realize that the community made the Spring Framework by embracing it, but also is able to break it. There are a few other DI containers out there that provide most basic functionality needed like DI, AOP, DAO's support (Spring is getting way to bloated anyway). So a massive switch of the open source community to a different framework is not unimaginable.

    At the moment I'll stick with Spring, but this announcement forces me to seriously investigate other frameworks as well. So the choice for Spring isn't as 'certain' as it was once.

    It is a shame that my 1000 post is based on such negative news. I would rather have helped someone with a tricky concurrency problem.

    [edit]
    This is my own opinion and doesn't need to reflect those of my employer.
    Last edited by Alarmnummer; Sep 25th, 2008, 08:45 AM.

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    • #3
      No tags

      According to the FAQ no tags for additional maintenance releases will be available

      http://www.springsource.com/products...ancepolicy/faq

      Thats is a bummer.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hmmmm yeah, wasn't expecting that one. I thought they would tag the current branch until the next major release, but by the sounds of it, nothing. Hmmmmmmm. If there are major releases close to the three month deadline, that would appease lots of people, but if these things are going to be more drawn out that's not good news.

        I haven't bought a subscription, the projects I've worked on wouldn't have bought subscriptions, but I've tried to contribute in some small way to the community. Where do people like me stand?

        Likewise, can you imagine the bugs that are going to get raised over this? What version were you running when you ran into this issue.................. Try recreating that one. I can just imagine the issues created with this change.

        It's a shame on many levels, but mostly because all of this negative noise will damage reputations. It was hard enough getting open source into companies in the past, but when negative noise like this is generated, it just makes people cynical e.g. "what stops SS changing their minds again and tightening up even more".
        Last edited by karldmoore; Sep 25th, 2008, 02:29 AM.

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        • #5
          Spring is dead, at least the framework we know... the framework that was community driven, the framework that was driven by ambitious developers who want to make development in a J2EE world a happier place.

          Early adopters, people that contributed a lot, people that loved spring by the freedom it gives to you as a developer... all those things are now about money.

          The problem of Spring is that it is getting too bloated, a lot of people are just using IOC and transaction support. Spring is used in a lot of small companies that use it just to standardize the development approach and to get a clean design. Those companies cannot afford these big licenses AND those companies cannot afford production problems due to a bug that is solved only for paying customers. Those companies are just screwed now! They invested a lot in Spring knowledge (trainings, knowledge of the framework, etc...) and they were happy.

          SpringSource will lose a lot of companies like these, because there are a lot more of these companies than the big multinationals...

          Now they just have to seek another way to standardize their way of development, invest another time in their people, etc;
          Luckily for them... Spring is non invasive and it will be simple enough to factor it out

          The decision is not wise and way too early...
          They should have changed their policies to the integration frameworks etc, but not on the core. Spring MVC, for example, is another way to do MVC, but it is not that great also, and thus not worth the money. Spring RCP is dead, Integration is quite not there yet, ...

          They'll regret this, a lot of negative comments from the community will get to the decision makers. They will not know the details and they will opt for another solution. They should have communicated it in a better way, but it's too late now!

          Comment


          • #6
            Forum Quality

            My personal disappointment is that for the last 3 or 4 years I have been visiting this forum regularly and helping people as good as possible (I have more than 1000 posts and almost all are answers to questions). This was my way to say thank you to the Spring Framework. That is why I think the quality of the Spring forum is going to suffer (people leaving, Spring people not answering on the forum but directly to customers).

            Of course the Spring Source guys will say that this won't happen, but in holland we call this 'pappen en nathouden'.

            So I'm considering to stop answering questions (even though I love to answer them).
            Last edited by Alarmnummer; Sep 26th, 2008, 04:54 AM.

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            • #7
              I'm also worried and disappointed about these points. It's kind of open source with a twist, you can have the code, but you probably won't be able to build it in a way that you'd like because there are no tags.

              I've tried to help out on various open source projects because I wanted to try and give something back for all the great software I got for free. I realise companies have to make money, but at the expense of long term users and supporters? Surely there must have been a better way here. If every three months there was a new version to upgrade to, I'd be happy to upgrade. If I wasn't happy to upgrade, there is always the option of paid support so I can keep getting patches for older versions. I do think it's strange how I can submit a patch for a release and then OTHER people can actually benefit from it long before I do (custom build not withstanding).

              I guess we'll have wait and see how this one pans out, I've already received emails from people declaring they are going to seek alternatives. This might be an empty threat, but I think there are lots of people thinking the same thing right now. Disappointing really, guess that sums it up.

              Comment


              • #8
                Maintenance Policy updated

                Hi Karl & others,

                Thank you and the other community members for all of your feedback regarding the SpringSource maintenance policy. Rod wrote a blog entry today explaining the policy in more detail and also identifying what we are doing to revise it based on the concerns that have been raised.

                Hopefully this will address some of the concerns raised here in the forums.

                Regards
                Adam FitzGerald
                SpringSource

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hi Adam,

                  Thanks for your response, to quote myself from the blog:

                  It's great to hear some positive news about Spring today after weeks of negative noise! I echo Daniel's sentiment, and hope that this news is reported in just as much as that of recent weeks. Thanks to Rod and the whole of SpringSource for proving that they do care about the communities views and are willing to take other opinions on board.

                  Thanks for producing a great product over the years and now ensuring I can continue to use it!
                  I'm really pleased about this change of heart and it addresses all of my concerns. I'm quite happy to keep upgrading to the latest version to get support, it seems like a fair compromise.

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